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Joe Edelman's avatar

I worked on this problem for more than a decade, as co-founder of what became the Center for Humane Tech, and in other roles.

One way to break it down is different users, but as Ivan notes towards the end, we all have Marl in us. So, another way to get at the same thing is to exclude certain engagements from the metrics — the things we click on but would not reflectively endorse as meaningful. You get a lower engagement number that represents meaningful choice, rather than just "revealed preference" / engagement.

This is what I work to align LLMs with at the Institute for Meaning Alignment[1], and Ivan is helping! I also have a paper[2] on the difference between revealed preference and meaningful choice.

(It's also worth noting that this process of enshittification doesn't just happen in software. Markets and voting also have this revealed preference vs meaningful choice problem. So, making this distinction is a chance to upgrade all of our large-scale systems.)

[1] https://meaningalignment.org/

[2] https://github.com/jxe/vpm/blob/master/vpm.pdf

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pleb.hodl's avatar

1. Hobbyist builder doesn't have to sell out.

2. Hobbyist builder that do sell out (at a good price) can use the capital to build even more hobbyist tools, instead of becoming a VC or retire on an island somewhere.

Hobbyist builder that fails both 1 & 2 is just another kind of Marl.

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